ATFs and Regular clients. Or, "There's one born every minute"

[Guest]

Many of the guys here talk about their ATF. After you have seen a provider many times, (become a regular), shouldn't you expect a "volume" discount?

Many of the guys here mention leaving a tip in the review section. I understand tipping for exemplary service. However, if you have a regular provider you frequently see, do you tip her every time? Why?

Who is the main benefactor from a regular client/provider relationship? The provider, who has a source of income she does not have to worry about from a safety standpoint? Or the client, who (it would appear from many of the comments I've read) is experiencing unrequited feelings of affection which the provider is merely taking advantage of?

Gentlemen, it would seem to me that, if you have a favorite provider you visit regularly, and she is not offering you a discount, then she does not want your return business very badly. You should take that as a hint, and find someone else.

And if you are paying more for her services than others are, because you are tipping every time; well, then you're just a sucker. You need to be aware that she is laughing at you as she takes your money.

[Goggles Paesano]

Many of the guys here talk about their ATF. After you have seen a provider many times, (become a regular), shouldn't you expect a "volume" discount?

Many of the guys here mention leaving a tip in the review section. I understand tipping for exemplary service. However, if you have a regular provider you frequently see, do you tip her every time? Why?

Who is the main benefactor from a regular client/provider relationship? The provider, who has a source of income she does not have to worry about from a safety standpoint? Or the client, who (it would appear from many of the comments I've read) is experiencing unrequited feelings of affection which the provider is merely taking advantage of?

Gentlemen, it would seem to me that, if you have a favorite provider you visit regularly, and she is not offering you a discount, then she does not want your return business very badly. You should take that as a hint, and find someone else.

And if you are paying more for her services than others are, because you are tipping every time; well, then you're just a sucker. You need to be aware that she is laughing at you as she takes your money.

It's refreshing to see someone express a little common sense...

+1

[MelindaMadison]

Nothing like the mentality that one should take lesser pay for consistently doing a good job..( ..gee

Or managing to mock ladies AND fellow hobbyists in your one post....charming.

[urfan]

Many of the guys here talk about their ATF. After you have seen a provider many times, (become a regular), shouldn't you expect a "volume" discount?

Many of the guys here mention leaving a tip in the review section. I understand tipping for exemplary service. However, if you have a regular provider you frequently see, do you tip her every time? Why?

Who is the main benefactor from a regular client/provider relationship? The provider, who has a source of income she does not have to worry about from a safety standpoint? Or the client, who (it would appear from many of the comments I've read) is experiencing unrequited feelings of affection which the provider is merely taking advantage of?

Gentlemen, it would seem to me that, if you have a favorite provider you visit regularly, and she is not offering you a discount, then she does not want your return business very badly. You should take that as a hint, and find someone else.

And if you are paying more for her services than others are, because you are tipping every time; well, then you're just a sucker. You need to be aware that she is laughing at you as she takes your money.

by your questions, i suspect you may misunderstand what the atf thing is all about.

#1 - don't ever expect a 'volume discount' - that's a truly horseshit point of view held by cheap-ass hobby horses imho

#2 - tipping is more of a session-by-session decision

#3 - the main benefactor is the client - and not because they're being hoodwinked as a consequence of their unrequited feelings - rather it's because it's a provider he feels a particular affinity towards and who consistently gives great service. plus, unless he's regularly dispensing huge amounts of cash, most girls have plenty of opportunities to see plenty of other guys most of the time.

#4 - ridiculous assumption - providers usually prefer a regular client's return biz - see #1 above regarding discount

#5 - huh? you pay what you pay. that's a pretty baseless assumption that providers snicker at their regulars after they've left because she's successfully overcharging them. more likely she's looking forward to seeing these guys again more than the slew of other miscellaneous pervs beating a path to her door.

[nairobi09]

Nothing like the mentality that one should take lesser pay for consistently doing a good job..( ..gee

Or managing to mock ladies AND fellow hobbyists in your one post....charming.

These issues have been raised and pummeled in numerous posts; there is going to be no consensus achieved here! Ho, Ho, Ho.

Seriously though......

I would hope that if regularity (well, you know what I mean) had been

established these things could be discussed openly and without discomfort.

If not then I would suspect there is a power imbalance that will doom the

happy (?) pattern of exchange. Of course I have not ever been a 'regular' but only a 'repeat customer.' For the semi-useless distinction between these please use the 'search' function above.

I do give tips sometimes, usually if travel has been involved but not charged for. Otherwise I have always thought that as the consumer I would simply decide how much I was willing to pay and it either is acceptable or not. No hard feelings involved there.

[MAG]

Fuck, another one of these threads.

Many providers have a "returning friends" fee that is discounted from the "regular fee". That's essentially your volume discount.

If you're unhappy with your provider's rates, and can find a "better deal", then go for it. If you can't find a better deal, then you're benefitting be getting the best deal possible for you, and she's benefitting by getting paid. Just because she may be laughing all the way to the bank doesn't mean you're getting the short end of the deal.

Stop over-analyzing it for gawd sakes. As long as you're both happy with your arrangement, what's the problem?

[Guest moose]

Gentlemen, it would seem to me that, if you have a favorite provider you visit regularly, and she is not offering you a discount, then she does not want your return business very badly.

If the provider takes your appointment, she wants your business, and paying the going rate is about as simple as it gets.

Discounts, tips, gifts, frequent flier points, premiere status....whatever....they all increase the potential for drama - which is the one thing I go out of my way to avoid in these arrangements.

[macho]

From my experience if you just do as the ATF says then nobody gets hurt.

[snowmanmc]

It's simple, my ATF gives me good rates to show her appreciation to me and I tip on top of that to show I appreciate her.

[limey]

Then there is the idea that "for you" she is the best there is. I'm lucky to have had this. I'll tip when you get this all day long. Its my choice.

Just an opinion, but the OP seems more negative about this whole thread and industry then most. Most times people don't want to be around this. Hence, this and other comments.

[VampireVictoria]

The OP really seems to miss the point to the arrangement between clients and providers. No one is in this business as a provider just to make friends. If a client is seeing a provider on a regular basis, it is because the client enjoys seeing the provider.

Why should the provider be paid less for doing a good job and keeping her clients happy? Where is the incentive for continuing to provide excellent customer service? Do you go to fancy restaurants and expect to pay less because you go there often? If you like a waitress's service and ask to sit in her section all the time, do you stop tipping her because she seems to genuinely like serving your meals?

A good client does not (nor does he need to) ask for a discount. Like any service based industry, good customers are hard to find and when a provider does find a regular client she enjoys, they get taken care of very well. If you are not finding an ATF who treats you well, the problem isn't with the provider. If the OP's post is any indication of his personality, I can see why.

[SmileyDawg]

Variation on rates thread, subject has been beaten senseless already

[Phantom]

Weird. I've bought gas at the same gas station every week for 10 years, yet I have never been offered a volume discount!

They must not appreciate me. I better buy my gas somewhere else.

[Nightrain]

Many of the guys here talk about their ATF. After you have seen a provider many times, (become a regular), shouldn't you expect a "volume" discount?

I once had an ATF (okay, actually 3 of them (heh)). They started calling me once a week or as they needed $. Eventually, I had to lower my donation as they started cutting too deep into my disposable, told them to take it or leave it. They took it, and I guess this was a sort of discount, so, yes, volume should come with a discount.

Many of the guys here mention leaving a tip in the review section. I understand tipping for exemplary service. However, if you have a regular provider you frequently see, do you tip her every time? Why?

As a general rule, I tip for good service of any kind. With ASPs, a few times (very few, in fact), I've not tipped as a sign of my dissatisfaction.

"Good service" meaning what was delivered was what was on the menu. And, it was delivered with a good atitude. If there was hesitation (or even refusal) to deliver what was on the menu then this was not good service and no tip.

Who is the main benefactor from a regular client/provider relationship?

For me, we both benefit from the encounter; she, in her way ($), and I in mine . As far as "unrequited feelings of affection", yes, I did fall in that trap once but after a time, I wised up and got out of that. Lesson learned. This was where the advice of a close friend should be sought.

Gentlemen, it would seem to me that, if you have a favorite provider you visit regularly, and she is not offering you a discount, then she does not want your return business very badly. You should take that as a hint, and find someone else.

I suppose this boils down to the frequency with which you see her. I think once every 2 months would be too infrequent to expect a discount. Once a month or more, I would broach the subject. Waiting for her to bring it up? You'll be waiting a long long time, IMO. If she's amenible to a discount, good, if not, yes, move on.

And if you are paying more for her services than others are, because you are tipping every time; well, then you're just a sucker. You need to be aware that she is laughing at you as she takes your money.

So long as she doesn't laugh in my face.

[geecue2]

Just came back from seeing my ATF, she got a late Christmas bonus from me and a gift.

[fork]

Weird. I've bought gas at the same gas station every week for 10 years, yet I have never been offered a volume discount!

They must not appreciate me. I better buy my gas somewhere else.

+1. Sums it up.

I pretty much never tip. And I do not expect a discount, volume or otherwise. But what you get from an ATF is a better experience each time, and probably you get "more" from her in the session than her first-time clients get. That's good enough for me.

I have given birthday presents to exactly one girl in 15 years of hobbying, so I guess you could call her my ATF (and now she has just disappeared, so I'll be crying in my soup till further notice).

[ideomar]

What bothers me though is when a provider ( FSBM or FS) noticing that a customer comes to see her on a regular basis( once or twice a week) starts to believe that the customer is so addicted to her that she can start ripping him off. I was in the situation for sometimes : The FSBM provider said to me that at our fourth meeting " you get away with lot of things and you don't tip me''( I have offered her a brand name perfume at our second encounter). I felt bad I start tipping( $ 5, 10, 25). She even argued once with me that I tipped her $ 8 instead of $ 25. She also added that " I will not do nothing for nothing." When I realized after re -reading her reviews that what she was calling " you get away with lot of things" was a regular basic service she offers to all of her clients, I decided to stop seeing her. I have found now some good providers with no upselling techniques

[geecue2]

What bothers me though is when a provider ( FSBM or FS) noticing that a customer comes to see her on a regular basis( once or twice a week) starts to believe that the customer is so addicted to her that she can start ripping him off. I was in the situation for sometimes : The FSBM provider said to me that at our fourth meeting " you get away with lot of things and you don't tip me''( I have offered her a brand name perfume at our second encounter). I felt bad I start tipping( $ 5, 10, 25). She even argued once with me that I tipped her $ 8 instead of $ 25. She also added that " I will not do nothing for nothing." When I realized after re -reading her reviews that what she was calling " you get away with lot of things" was a regular basic service she offers to all of her clients, I decided to stop seeing her. I have found now some good providers with no upselling techniques

You did the right thing, definitely not a good situation there.

[Guest]

After you have seen a provider many times, (become a regular), shouldn't you expect a "volume" discount?

Someone like that is not someone we like to see a lot (be a regular;)) of.

Real talk, son.

What bothers me though is when a provider ( FSBM or FS) noticing that a customer comes to see her on a regular basis( once or twice a week) starts to believe that the customer is so addicted to her that she can start ripping him off.

Anybody ripping anybody off is never a good situation. Good thing there are plenty of fish in the sea. If somebody rips you off, you should probably never see them again. And make sure and write a review. Be done, move on and have fun with somebody else.

I give discounts to guys that I see fit. Not guys that EXPECT it.

Just like anybody, I appreciate regular business. Regular business does not generally come from guys that are constantly looking for negotiating options.

[Guest ezduzit]

I have had some ATFs/regulars slack off and get lazy with their professionalism, which kind of gets my gall and typically takes them off my ATF list.

Accordingly I can see providers getting a little miffed about being expected to reduce rates for regular service. The game goes both ways.

I think if a guy was truly offering to visit regularly and live up to it, a reduced rate inquiry shouldn't be treated as an insult, but neither should the hobbyist be put off if the answer is a simple "no, I don't do that".

Making it in the pay for time business is all about rates and realization (how may of your available hours can you bill). And this particular business is not like lawyers and CPAs where you can expect to sit at your desk and consistently bag 10 billable hours a day. Hobbyists have to respect that.

By the same token, providers need to understand that much of their client population had budget limitations and so the issue will tend to come up regularly and to handle the response diplomatically.

[Vic Kosslovich]

Oddly enough, every time I go to see the Rockies, they charge me a fee for my seat. For some games they even charge me more. Sometimes I can get tickets at a discount but it's on their schedule, not mine.

My ATF is my ATF because she makes me feel special. She's an actress and I get that, but she's a good actress. Do I always tip her? No.... but when I do it's because she went above and beyond the call of duty.

Is she laughing at me when I leave? Nope... she's smart enough to realize that certain behaviors are more likely to elicit a tip so she's making mental notes of what really worked so she can try that, or things like that in the future.

[boink36]

Weird. I've bought gas at the same gas station every week for 10 years, yet I have never been offered a volume discount!

They must not appreciate me. I better buy my gas somewhere else.

+1, Lets add Xcel Energy to that list. if you buy in volum from Xcel

they charge more.

[Guest]

Like any service based industry, good customers are hard to find and when a provider does find a regular client she enjoys, they get taken care of very well.

By "enjoy", what do you mean? Do you only give discounts to clients you find attractive or who satisfy you?

If the OP's post is any indication of his personality, I can see why.

I'm sorry if I don't express myself well. But I'm not a bad guy.

Someone like that is not someone we like to see a lot (be a regular;)) of.

Real talk, son.

I give discounts to guys that I see fit.

Again with the special treatment, just like VV above. Who gets special treatment? Why?

I really have not expressed anything different than the guy in this thread:

http://www.theotherboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37586

I'm just trying to figure out why some guys get special treatment and some don't. Not because I'm jealous (well, maybe just a little), but because I hope to learn. As many may have guessed, I've never been very confident around women.

[Guest]

Who gets special treatment? Why?

The guy that doesn't expect it. Because he doesn't expect it.

[Goggles Paesano]

I'm just trying to figure out why some guys get special treatment and some don't. Not because I'm jealous (well, maybe just a little), but because I hope to learn. As many may have guessed, I've never been very confident around women.

Dude, don't puss out! Your tone in this post is markedly different from your original post. Stick to your guns. You are entitled to your opinion... as is every other poster on this forum. They may not agree with or like what you have to say and that's okay. But don't back down and let the general consensus "bully" you into conceding your point of view... especially the women on here... geez.

[mj76]

I'm just trying to figure out why some guys get special treatment and some don't. Not because I'm jealous (well, maybe just a little), but because I hope to learn.

I'm not sure that it is something that can be taught or learned. It's something that is just going to happen when and if she's ever ready. Just be a gentleman and if you get lucky it might happen but I wouldn't count on it.

[Guest moose]

Just came back from seeing my ATF, she got a late Christmas bonus from me and a gift.

Just my view, and not intending to pick a fight with a patriarch, but good on you for paying extra for the privilege of being regarded as a "nice guy"

[VampireVictoria]

By "enjoy", what do you mean? Do you only give discounts to clients you find attractive or who satisfy you?

I'm sorry if I don't express myself well. But I'm not a bad guy.

Again with the special treatment, just like VV above. Who gets special treatment? Why?

I really have not expressed anything different than the guy in this thread:

http://www.theotherboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37586

I'm just trying to figure out why some guys get special treatment and some don't. Not because I'm jealous (well, maybe just a little), but because I hope to learn. As many may have guessed, I've never been very confident around women.

Laplace, thanks for trying to make amends. I agree with the guy who said your opinion should not be bullied, so I hope you're not posting this just to appease the masses. If you really want answers, I'm happy to provide.

The girls who work as providers are doing a job. They provide a service, and the ones who actually put effort into making sure their clients are happy deserve to be paid more, not less, for their attention to detail and customer service skills. When you suggest they are ripping people off and laughing all the way to the bank by not offering discounts, its offensive. Who in their right mind works harder just to be rewarded with less money?

As far as people getting special treatment, that's a complicated question to answer. I'm the Vampire Victoria; When a client shows up and wants to talk to me about vampires, roleplay with me, genuinely enjoys spending time with me and has a great time in our session, I look forward to seeing them again. Some clients tell me how awesome I am and make me feel special, and tell me what a good time they've had, and I can tell, so I enjoy spending time with them. All of my regulars are great, or they don't become regulars. The only people I've ever dumped as clients have insisted I give them a discount or extra time, at my own expense. That's never fun to deal with.

On the other hand, I've had good regulars who have called me up for an hour and I stayed all night because I was having a great time and I didn't have another appointment scheduled. I've had regulars who were having a rough time financially and just wanted to hang so I let them decide what they could afford. I've seen clients who lived far away because their car was broken down, and I didn't charge a traveling fee or raise my rates.

Those are the things you should expect from your ATF, not a flat discount. And even those things shouldn't ever be asked for. Extras and special treatment are bonuses, like tips and gifts. No one should expect them, but when you get them, you should appreciate them for what they are.

[geecue2]

Just my view, and not intending to pick a fight with a patriarch, but good on you for paying extra for the privilege of being regarded as a "nice guy"

To me its not paying extra to be considered a nice guy, it is what it is, a bonus and a gift thats all.

[MAG]

To me its not paying extra to be considered a nice guy, it is what it is, a bonus and a gift thats all.

At Christmas time, yes a bonus or a gift is usually just that.

Otherwise, not so much.