Typical Newbie Cluelessness...

[Joe Schmoe]

Hey all, newbie here that has been reading back posts and been curious for a while. Highly interested but have yet to take the plunge, so to speak. This board has been helpful in how to watch out for the typical ASP/LE scams and various dangers, even if at times a bit misogynistic. I'm often pleasantly surprised at how forthright and lucid the comments are, from both providers and customers.

I feel confident enough to get started, but am hesitating over what is perhaps the perennial catch-22 for a noob: how to get started without any references. Before you say so, yes, I have read the back posts and have a good idea that one finds a newbie friendly lady and starts to build a "resume" from there- but I also read again and again to not give out any personal information; to have references or a P411 account and only use that. I completely understand their need for safety, but of course have to also consider mine. I have been looking into P411, and realize that there are arguments for and against. I would love to have two references to get the P411 free trial offer and see if it works for me, but am stuck on the whole "no personal information" warning. Any suggestions? Should I bite the bullet the first few times out and divulge whatever the providers ask?

Thanks in advance

[Lucy Kitten]

We've had lots of arguments about this and it makes for some fun reading. No snark implied, I would highly suggest reading those threads so we can potentially avoid another long winded discussion.

Pick the info you feel comfortable sharing and call around until you find a girl who suits your taste and will accept the info you are willing to share.

[geecue2]

It seems you have done your homework, now its up to you. Do what makes you comfortable. When I was a noobie, I got lucky, well reviewed lady that seen me without references. Just be yourself.

[pitbull]

I gave my info to a well-reviewed lady, and all went well. Then I gave my info to another well-reviewed lady, and all again went well. I did this three more times, and again it all went well. Was that stupid? Maybe. The odds that they want to ruin your life are incredibly low (not zero), but LOW.

If you are uncomfortable with the low risk, join p411. So far, I have not heard one person on this board ever say that joining p411 led to any misery. People have said it theoretically could happen, but it never has. Unfortunately, this is an illegal activity, but you can lower your risk considerably by going with well-reviewed ladies who do not have a reputation for crazy behavior.

[MAG]

I gave my info to a well-reviewed lady, and all went well. Then I gave my info to another well-reviewed lady, and all again went well. I did this three more times, and again it all went well. Was that stupid? Maybe. The odds that they want to ruin your life are incredibly low (not zero), but LOW.

If you are uncomfortable with the low risk, join p411. So far, I have not heard one person on this board ever say that joining p411 led to any misery. People have said it theoretically could happen, but it never has. Unfortunately, this is an illegal activity, but you can lower your risk considerably by going with well-reviewed ladies who do not have a reputation for crazy behavior.

Fixed it.

[Guest]

Fixed it.

Good thinking av8r.....

I am a Denver based hooker, I have been outed. Hell I am currently being outed right now. But I have nothing to lose. So it doesn't effect me.

If you wanna be a fool, take the risk with your family, your job, your neighbors, your friends, your wifes job if you got one, they will even go

to your relatives jobs, there is even cyber bullys who put your name your pictures on on the internet. Post your personal info on websites.

So when you looking for a job... that hooker fucked you in the ass.... lol You have nothing to lose right? Fuck it give all the girls your

personal info. This is the smartest thing you can do. Go for it. (I'm being a smart ass)

The stupidest thing you can ever do is give any hooker your personal information. Hope you don't piss off one the girls, who will

retaliate, and destroy your life, destroy your job. Good luck with that. Just put bullet in your head. Don't let your dick do your

thinking.

Why can't you give your ID to p411? Then you don't need 2 references. There are girls who are newbie friendly they won't ask

you for your info at all. But they will see you at higher risk rate. Start asking the guys who doesn't require screening.

[pfunk]

Any suggestions?

Make a list of everything you could lose if you were arrested for solicitation.

If the risk, of that loss, is too great, stop right now. That is a possibilty, as well as a girl outing you.

I've taken many risks in this arena, as have most guys, and been very lucky. A few guys have been burned.

You have to choose what risk you are willing to take, if any. Good Luck!

[Guest]

Well, this might make some of the other gals not like me so much, but I would say to do your research on which providers in the area can be trusted with personal info, and then give whatever personal info she asks for. Personally, I see the power dynamics of this sort of interaction to be off balance from the get-go. One of the ways that clients help me to feel like we're starting on more equal footing is to trust me with their information. I have never used a clients personal info to ruin their life- blacklisted clients, yes, but not just because they annoyed me or didn't follow procedure. Only because they didn't respect my boundaries, and in fact pushed way past them. I would only use the personal info of a client to "ruin their life" if they did something truly awful to me, such as attempted to murder me or caused me great physical harm.

Try to find a provider who seems level headed and then follow her lead on what she wants to know about you. There can be some negotiation on what sort of screening you do if you don't have references, but for the most part I would say to just be up front and trust her. When you show that you trust a provider that almost always indicates to us that we can trust you.

[boink36]

Well, this might make some of the other gals not like me so much, but I would say to do your research on which providers in the area can be trusted with personal info, and then give whatever personal info she asks for. Personally, I see the power dynamics of this sort of interaction to be off balance from the get-go. One of the ways that clients help me to feel like we're starting on more equal footing is to trust me with their information. I have never used a clients personal info to ruin their life- blacklisted clients, yes, but not just because they annoyed me or didn't follow procedure. Only because they didn't respect my boundaries, and in fact pushed way past them. I would only use the personal info of a client to "ruin their life" if they did something truly awful to me, such as attempted to murder me or caused me great physical harm.

Try to find a provider who seems level headed and then follow her lead on what she wants to know about you. There can be some negotiation on what sort of screening you do if you don't have references, but for the most part I would say to just be up front and trust her. When you show that you trust a provider that almost always indicates to us that we can trust you.

If you really want to be helpful, please provide us with a detailed list of the colorado providers who can and can't be trusted. if you can't do that it's not a good idea to tell guys they should trust providers you know nothing about.

[Guest]

If you really want to be helpful, please provide us with a detailed list of the colorado providers who can and can't be trusted. if you can't do that it's not a good idea to tell guys they should trust providers you know nothing about.

I'm Out!

I'm currently collecting toenail samples and hair clippings. I foresee my *World Domination* plan coming together nicely in 1 large hair doll!

[fork]

Make a list of everything you could lose if you were arrested for solicitation.

If the risk, of that loss, is too great, stop right now. That is a possibilty, as well as a girl outing you.

This is a good thing to keep in mind. However if you do your research, an arrest is a very remote risk. (I bet that if we took a poll here a lot more guys would have had their lives ruined by the wife finding out rather than an arrest. The Police hath no fury like a woman scorned.)

And, don't forget that lots of girls don't ask for any personal information.

[boink36]

I'm Out!

I'm currently collecting toenail samples and hair clippings. I foresee my *World Domination* plan coming together nicely in 1 large hair doll!

[Guest]

If you really want to be helpful, please provide us with a detailed list of the colorado providers who can and can't be trusted. if you can't do that it's not a good idea to tell guys they should trust providers you know nothing about.

Yeah. This. I would LOVE to see this list.

Or better yet, somebody should give the poor sap a few names of providers who don't screen via personal info. They're out there. But then, the OP himself may be law enforcement. Mistrust flows both ways.

Here's a pretty safe way to do it. Fly to Dallas. Spend the weekend. Hire two highly reviewed ladies. Tell them you're from out of town, and you are deliberately looking for two ladies who will give references, and that you'll never be in Dallas again in your lifetime. Give them your screening info, treat them like

queens, and tip heavily. Come back to Denver and use those references to start your local reference list.

Here's a better approach. Give your screening info ONE TIME to an out-of-country business whose reputation depends on confidentiality. Yep: P411. Then see local newbie friendly providers. It's then up to you to set the other reputation stuff. Be polite. Wash your ass. Stuff like that.

Of course, if you DO hurt one of the ladies, P411 will turn your info over to whomever in a New York Minute. But thats the way it should be.

While they can keep your real world info safe, the one thing P411 can't do is protect your "reputation." If one of the ladies decides she is angry at you for something you posted (like a not favorable review) she will put your P411 ID on a blacklist. Then you have to start over. Annoying, but not devastating.

[Guest]

Yeah. This. I would LOVE to see this list.

Or better yet, somebody should give the poor sap a few names of providers who don't screen via personal info. They're out there. But then, the OP himself may be law enforcement. Mistrust flows both ways.

Here's a pretty safe way to do it. Fly to Dallas. Spend the weekend. Hire two highly reviewed ladies. Tell them you're from out of town, and you are deliberately looking for two ladies who will give references, and that you'll never be in Dallas again in your lifetime. Give them your screening info, treat them like

queens, and tip heavily. Come back to Denver and use those references to start your local reference list.

Here's a better approach. Give your screening info ONE TIME to an out-of-country business whose reputation depends on confidentiality. Yep: P411. Then see local newbie friendly providers. It's then up to you to set the other reputation stuff. Be polite. Wash your ass. Stuff like that.

Of course, if you DO hurt one of the ladies, P411 will turn your info over to whomever in a New York Minute. But thats the way it should be.

While they can keep your real world info safe, the one thing P411 can't do is protect your "reputation." If one of the ladies decides she is angry at you for something you posted (like a not favorable review) she will put your P411 ID on a blacklist. Then you have to start over. Annoying, but not devastating.

[gr8owl]

I would say to do your research on which providers in the area can be trusted with personal info,

Unfortunately, I have yet to find any review site that includes the following as identifiers when rating ladies: bat shit crazy, vindictive, vengeful, gets furious with less than fantastic rating, etc. Combined with the fact that there are at least two I know of that have a silent wink and nod reputation for exactly that. No one dare mention their names in public (humorous all in all) but they are still quite active with well over 50 reviews between them. So while your advice is solid, I do not know how one, especially a newbie, can actually do it.

Try to find a provider who seems level headed and then follow her lead on what she wants to know about you. There can be some negotiation on what sort of screening you do if you don't have references, but for the most part I would say to just be up front and trust her. When you show that you trust a provider that almost always indicates to us that we can trust you.

You seem level headed and trust worthy and are definitely on my " I am intrigued" list, but realistically I have no way of knowing unless and until we meet. When first easing into the internet phase of the "hobby" I gave a couple ladies a lot of information. It turned out fine, but I probably would not do so again.

To the OP: I remain convinced the safest approach for those with something to lose, at least until they have been around the block a few times, is a p411 membership, see newbie friendly and refuse to give them more info than your id via the p411 email system. If that is not good enough move on. Alternatively, make a list of ladies that have at least been verified through reviews as not total rip offs or LE and start calling. Some will see you with nothing more than you sounding calm, polite and non-psychotic on the phone. Best of luck!

[Guest]

Any hooker ever asks you for your Colorado State ID, you tell her NO, unless she submits her personal information to you first by Colorado State ID.

Otherwise don't it. Don't be fooled. Don't let your dick do the thinking. In Colorado there have many outings, several people lives who have been effective by this. Don't it.

All you need to do is ask "THE MEN" what happens when you get outed?

All you need to di is ask "the hookers" what happens to you when you get outed?

[Denguy40]

This thread is completely out of hand.

Op. See a chick who is well known but newbie friendly and will see you with minimum info. They exist and it's easy peasy.

Tell her you'll use her as a reference.

Done. Have fun for gods sake. I hope the crazy shit posted in the thread didn't make you go limp. I am.

[Guest]

Everyone has to start somewhere. I say be willing to provide (within reason) whatever info you see fit to give for initial screening. you may run into some pretty harsh screening methods.....please note that for some ladies that is for their need to feel safe for a multitude of reasons. Keep going until you find the right lady. Remember to be very respectful and polite in your initial contact as this goes a long way. Explain that you are a newbie and you would like to know what type of info is needed to make her feel safe.IF you are not comfortable with providing that info, move on until you find someone who suites your needs. Search reviews, stay off of Back page until you know what you are doing, and most of all have fun. Not all of us bite, although some might nibble, just be yourself but be nice and you should be ok. If not, that is a good clue to not see a particular lady. not everyone meshes with everyone, not matter how hot someone is. Good luck and happy hunting!

[macho]

Jesus h Christ. Get a clue fool. Just kidding . See my friend the thing is the chance of getting caught is slim. If you say the wrong thing then the chance increase a lot. The point when I throw my self in the mix I was scared. I picked the the first post on BP or Craig's. I figured if this was the LE I had it cum in. When she walked into th door I grilled her. I asked a few questions. Stuff I never ask today. Well after the first one I thought to myself I never want to go through this again. Well things are way more thought out. And I still get nervous when I meet a girl. Anyways I know this is little side tracked but I can't thank you girls enough for what you do. Thank you

[HappyHarryHardon]

Any hooker ever asks you for your Colorado State ID, you tell her NO, unless she submits her personal information to you first by Colorado State ID.

Otherwise don't it. Don't be fooled. Don't let your dick do the thinking. In Colorado there have many outings, several people lives who have been effective by this. Don't it.

All you need to do is ask "THE MEN" what happens when you get outed?

All you need to di is ask "the hookers" what happens to you when you get outed?

You do realize that you give some of the shittiest advice I have ever heard. I have been hobbying for over 20 years and you are the ONLY person with these idiotic situations, and even more your idiotic advice. By your advice, and if people follow it, nobody is going to be able to get laid. Please stop. Nobody is stalking you, outting you, or anything else. A normal, sane person would have taken action. I know I would have. I personally am tired of hearing about it. It's clearly not a problem for you, because it is NOT HAPPENING. Get help!

For the love of (insert deity) stop spewing your public nonsense. It is people like you that ruin the hobby. I have no tolerance for it. And please lern to spell and learn the difference between their, there, they're, it's its, it is, no, and know, and please do not tell me it is because you speak multiple languages. You do not. Nor are you from England. I lived there for over 10 years. You have the most fake accent I have ever heard. Yes, I called you once. listened to your accent and knew, fake. Where I come from this type of behavior would never be tolerated. WHY?

[Guest]

" Should I bite the bullet the first few times out and divulge whatever the providers ask? "

Rarely have I ever been asked my "real" name. In a case where she wants ID I would pass on seeing her.

One time I had a gal refuse to see me because I called and told her my email name. She then wanted to set appointment but wanted an ID! So I told her my real name. She got all moralistic and refused to see me because I lied about my name in the first place. So we both MIGHT be doing something illegal but you won't see me because I didn't tell you my real name?

Seeing ladies runs the gamut of screening. Some don't at all. Other want references. Some want P411.

I never worried about being outed because I never gave ID. And I don't think the ladies here are interested in outing you unless you really deserve it by doing something.

As ROMN stated, have fun and don't worry about it.

[jennyofdenver]

just do what the provider asks for...give up your info...ive known of no one provider that has hurt clients in my circle of girlfriends over the years.what choice do you really have?

[snip}

[snip}

Edited January 25, 2015 by boink36
Advertising removed.

[inkspot]

"

unless you really deserve it by doing something.

Yes, something like writing a review.

[gr8owl]

just do what the provider asks for...give up your info...ive known of no one provider that has hurt clients in my circle of girlfriends over the years.what choice do you really have?

There are literally hundreds of working ladies in this state. Each is different. Find one with a level of screening you are comfortable with. The flip side - there are tens of thousands of johns in the state. Find those comfortable providing the information you feel you need. Each side needs to find his/her comfort level, but each side needs to weigh their acceptable risk level against their personal potential for loss. Those with the most to lose should really exercise the most care. Not rocket surgery.

[Guest]

To clarify: when I say do your research and choose a provider who seems level headed, all I'm talking about is using some common sense. If it makes you nervous to give your personal info out to someone you don't know, then look for someone who makes you feel less nervous.

And honestly, a provider who doesn't ask for any personal info at all would make me more nervous than a provider who asks for a lot of personal info. You know that provider who is asking for a lot is looking out for herself and her safety, and probably your safety too. A provider who doesn't ask you for any whatsoever... well, I'm not here to judge how they do their business and I can't think of a good way to put this. It just seems like they'd be more likely to be someone you couldn't trust. Definitely not the case all of the time, there's all sorts of reasons for a provider to not ask for personal info. But I'm sure y'all can think of a few reasons why someone who was up to no good might use that tactic to lure you in.

[gr8owl]

To clarify: when I say do your research and choose a provider who seems level headed, all I'm talking about is using some common sense. If it makes you nervous to give your personal info out to someone you don't know, then look for someone who makes you feel less nervous.

And honestly, a provider who doesn't ask for any personal info at all would make me more nervous than a provider who asks for a lot of personal info. You know that provider who is asking for a lot is looking out for herself and her safety, and probably your safety too. A provider who doesn't ask you for any whatsoever... well, I'm not here to judge how they do their business and I can't think of a good way to put this. It just seems like they'd be more likely to be someone you couldn't trust. Definitely not the case all of the time, there's all sorts of reasons for a provider to not ask for personal info. But I'm sure y'all can think of a few reasons why someone who was up to no good might use that tactic to lure you in.

And now it becomes clear that we actually pretty closely agree. Including on the theory that "if she doesn't care about her safety, why would she care about mine?"

[pitbull]

Fixed it.

Yes, I agree the risk is NOT ZERO. Put it in bold, red, and italicized.

[pitbull]

You do realize that you give some of the shittiest advice I have ever heard. I have been hobbying for over 20 years and you are the ONLY person with these idiotic situations, and even more your idiotic advice. By your advice, and if people follow it, nobody is going to be able to get laid. Please stop. Nobody is stalking you, outting you, or anything else. A normal, sane person would have taken action. I know I would have. I personally am tired of hearing about it. It's clearly not a problem for you, because it is NOT HAPPENING. Get help!

For the love of (insert deity) stop spewing your public nonsense. It is people like you that ruin the hobby. I have no tolerance for it. And please lern to spell and learn the difference between their, there, they're, it's its, it is, no, and know, and please do not tell me it is because you speak multiple languages. You do not. Nor are you from England. I lived there for over 10 years. You have the most fake accent I have ever heard. Yes, I called you once. listened to your accent and knew, fake. Where I come from this type of behavior would never be tolerated. WHY?

I have personally spoken with a guy who dealt with a crazy, vindictive hooker who went to his place of work. You may have been hobbying for 20 years, but it only takes one hooker to ruin your life. You are a 23-post guy, but Nikki and many others have said the same thing over and over again. What motivation do they have to lie?

[gr8owl]

And please lern to spell Where I come from this type of behavior would never be tolerated. WHY?

LOL.

Nikki may be a bit fervent in her opinions and perhaps far to one side of the argument, but she is certainly consistent and entitled to her opinion. And yes, there are bat shit crazies that will and do out people. Glad it has never hit you. Or me.

[MAG]

You do realize that you give some of the shittiest advice I have ever heard. I have been hobbying for over 20 years and you are the ONLY person with these idiotic situations, and even more your idiotic advice. By your advice, and if people follow it, nobody is going to be able to get laid. Please stop. Nobody is stalking you, outting you, or anything else. A normal, sane person would have taken action. I know I would have. I personally am tired of hearing about it. It's clearly not a problem for you, because it is NOT HAPPENING. Get help!

For the love of (insert deity) stop spewing your public nonsense. It is people like you that ruin the hobby. I have no tolerance for it. And please lern to spell and learn the difference between their, there, they're, it's its, it is, no, and know, and please do not tell me it is because you speak multiple languages. You do not. Nor are you from England. I lived there for over 10 years. You have the most fake accent I have ever heard. Yes, I called you once. listened to your accent and knew, fake. Where I come from this type of behavior would never be tolerated. WHY?

Wow.

You're the one who needs help. If you don't like the advice you read here, why don't you just ignore it?

As others have said, people HAVE been outed. Just because you've been in the hobby for two decades and it has never happened to you, doesn't mean it hasn't happened to others.

Maybe it doesn't happen often, but it DOES happen. If you're tired of hearing about it, stop paying so much attention to it.