A Question to other providers..

[Guest]

I have been on the Board since February and this is my first thread. Something happened earlier that has me feeling uneasy. I took a call from a gentleman with an Illinois number and we talked a couple of times and he set up an appointment. I had given him my address to my incall and told him to call me when he was here to get my condo number. He called back ten minutes before said appointment, told me he was here, and asked me for my condo number. Well, I gave it to him and then he just never showed. After calling him back 3 times in a 45 minute period after he was supposedly here, I realized he was a NC/NS. I find it disturbing that this person would tell me he was here when in reality he wasn't and now he knows where I live. My question to other providers is how do you go about this kinda thing instead of the usual "I blocked him on my phone." I would hate to be a sitting duck if he is/was up to no good. To say the least, I am bit raddled.

[Barbi Dahl]

Hi Kari...

Please realize most gentlemen you will encounter are decent and have no ulterior motives or desires in contacting or seeing a lady....However becasue there is that one who occasionally has an ulterior motive, it is suggested that you not use your private residence for your incall location....That would elminate the concerns you are having now, if you had taken that precaution to protect your privacy and home in such a situation...

You will find much is said about this on both the part of ladies offering incall or gentlemen looking for outcalls and using your residence does put you at some risk.....

Sorry for your concerns and hopefully it is not ever a problem but for your own piece of mind, it is recommended that you change this practice....

Have a wonderful day...

Barbi

[pitbull]

Damn. That is a bit creepy.

Particularly the first couple of times I did this odd hobby, I was so nervous I nearly turned around and said forget it. It's possible he just got nervous or thought he saw phantom LE. It may be as innocent as that. I think he probably just chickened out.

[Guest]

Damn. That is a bit creepy.

Particularly the first couple of times I did this odd hobby, I was so nervous I nearly turned around and said forget it. It's possible he just got nervous or thought he saw phantom LE. It may be as innocent as that. I think he probably just chickened out.

Same here. Met my first (and only) provider at the end of May and almost turned around multiple times. She did things kind of the same as Kari does and damn near turned away even while I was waiting outside the building.

But luckily the little head prevailed and a good night was had. I can see how it can be super scary on both sides of the hobby game, but hopefully this guy just got cold feet at the last moment.

That being said, I think the sketchiest part is the no contact afterwards.

What is everyone's preference of incall versus outcall? I think I'd rather have someone come to my place rather than go to their's, but of course then there is a ton of information available which is terrible for discretion.

[Guest]

Could be he did see Leo. Once when I was going into an incall parking lot, a county Sheriff car pulled in just before me! Scared me! I left the area and called the lady and told her about it. Well a few minutes later the sheriff went around back with a guy and looked at his vehicle. I went an enjoyed my visit.

Another time I was just leaving a visit with a lady. There were 2 Leo's in the lobby! As I walked to exit, another Leo pulled up. This one was a lady cop! I thought holy crap they are going to bust the gal I was just with! I didn't stick around to find out what happened. Anyway lots of reason why Kari's guy bailed. Could be got nervous.

[Guest]

Hi Kari,

I know exactly what you are talking about and how creepy it feels. I had an apartment a few years ago and a couple of times it happened. The way I got around this is I went out and met them in the parking lot. So when I would give a gent the building number I never gave the exact apartment. I walked out to the front of the building and we walked up together. Solved the problem and I never had a guy tell me he was there when he wasn't. When guy would ask for the exact apt number I would just tell him that I will come down and meet you. Period case closed.

[AlexZane]

Great Response Melissa!!!! I have had that happen a 5 or 6 times. More then I'd like! It is very nerve racking ! But it does happen for whatever reason. Refraining from posting pics of face helps.

[Guest]

If someone does that bs to me, they can enjoy trying to schedule any more.providrrs, cause making me HAVE TO lock my front door just to go grab my mail will get you SO blacklisted, alerted, and subsequently told to get bent. This is sneaky and I have to assume the worst about the creepy move. Blacklist his ass and watch your back.

[Guest]

If someone does that bs to me, they can enjoy trying to schedule any more.providrrs, cause making me HAVE TO lock my front door just to go grab my mail will get you SO blacklisted, alerted, and subsequently told to get bent. This is sneaky and I have to assume the worst about the creepy move. Blacklist his ass and watch your back.

And forward his information along to other Ladies and let them know they can pass the info along to their friends. Keep the Ladies informed and safe.

[Servius]

I am not a provider, but will answer anyway.

Many hobbyists would probably prefer a residence, one's own (when possible) or the lady's. I did in my day.

With that said, a lady should never provide from her personal residence to anyone she does not know well, very well, and a few rolls in the hay is insufficient. Not only is there the issue of physical safety, and things do happen later that are not manifest in the early part of a relationship, but also personal identity can be easily established based on one's residence. Ownership can be easily established, and more sophisticated investigators can even discover personal info by virtue of tenancy.

Overhead is an issue, of course, and I understand that. Plus hotels have their own set of problems. There is no risk-free accommodation. But one's residence is a surefire way of exposing one's personal information and making stalking and harassment from bozos more convenient.

The "meet the guy in the parking lot" technique is advisable to ensure you're not giving info out to random folk, but it still does not protect one's identity, and now someone who may not be what he appears knows where you reside.

If you use your residence, make certain your screening is very tight and that your references are very credible from people with good judgment and repeated experiences with that individual. A simple p411 OK without elaboration is inadequate.

People do get the willys and back out for various reasons, as others have said. Happens all the time. Rude to not say something to you. Probably just a harmless person with second thoughts. BUT, there are a minority of folks who are not harmless. I would advise anyone using their residence to be ultra careful and to never do it with a newbie without references. I don't care what kind of work/personal info (easy to manufacture) you acquire.

Something to consider.

[frankenthaler91]

I am not a provider, but will answer anyway.

Many hobbyists would probably prefer a residence, one's own (when possible) or the lady's. I did in my day.

With that said, a lady should never provide from her personal residence to anyone she does not know well, very well, and a few rolls in the hay is insufficient. Not only is there the issue of physical safety, and things do happen later that are not manifest in the early part of a relationship, but also personal identity can be easily established based on one's residence. Ownership can be easily established, and more sophisticated investigators can even discover personal info by virtue of tenancy.

Overhead is an issue, of course, and I understand that. Plus hotels have their own set of problems. There is no risk-free accommodation. But one's residence is a surefire way of exposing one's personal information and making stalking and harassment from bozos more convenient.

The "meet the guy in the parking lot" technique is advisable to ensure you're not giving info out to random folk, but it still does not protect one's identity, and now someone who may not be what he appears knows where you reside.

If you use your residence, make certain your screening is very tight and that your references are very credible from people with good judgment and repeated experiences with that individual. A simple p411 OK without elaboration is inadequate.

People do get the willys and back out for various reasons, as others have said. Happens all the time. Rude to not say something to you. Probably just a harmless person with second thoughts. BUT, there are a minority of folks who are not harmless. I would advise anyone using their residence to be ultra careful and to never do it with a newbie without references. I don't care what kind of work/personal info (easy to manufacture) you acquire.

Something to consider.

Anything that a guy "might" do to a lady, a lady can do to a guy.

You have a nice place? TV's, stereos, other furnishings, cash laying around? Who's to say she or her "boyfriend" don't stop by sometime and clean you out?

[Servius]

Anything that a guy "might" do to a lady, a lady can do to a guy.

You have a nice place? TV's, stereos, other furnishings, cash laying around? Who's to say she or her "boyfriend" don't stop by sometime and clean you out?

Much of what you say is true, of course, but the question was from a lady, which is what I addressed. The part that is less true to my mind is that of relative harm, in that the average lady cannot do as much harm to an average guy, physically. Moreover, I suspect based purely on my anecdotal experience in the hobby (which is considerable) that a much higher percentage of guys are stalkers and harassers, often the deluded lovelorn who feel gilted and mistake the hobby for match.com.

[Guest]

Much of what you say is true, of course, but the question was from a lady, which is what I addressed. The part that is less true to my mind is that of relative harm, in that the average lady cannot do as much harm to an average guy, physically. Moreover, I suspect based purely on my anecdotal experience in the hobby (which is considerable) that a much higher percentage of guys are stalkers and harassers, often the deluded lovelorn who feel gilted and mistake the hobby for match.com.

Here is where we disagree. God may have made man and woman, but Samuel Colt made them equal.

[Servius]

Ha! Good point. Yes, but the stats would suggest that option is seldom employed. Regretably so. Several of my friends always had a chemical spray nearby. Not just for me, I hope! But seriously, I am afraid those forms of defense might not be as effective when caught off guard. Best to use preventive measures in the first instance, I think. Nice backups though.

[frankenthaler91]

Much of what you say is true, of course, but the question was from a lady, which is what I addressed. The part that is less true to my mind is that of relative harm, in that the average lady cannot do as much harm to an average guy, physically. Moreover, I suspect based purely on my anecdotal experience in the hobby (which is considerable) that a much higher percentage of guys are stalkers and harassers, often the deluded lovelorn who feel gilted and mistake the hobby for match.com.

Physical harm should be the least of one's worry. If they know where you live, they know your name, easy enough to google an address or stalk your mailbox. Follow you to where you work.

From that, you life as you know it can cease to exist.

[Servius]

Less probable, to be sure, but perhaps not least concerning if it is your body. But I agree, the more likely untoward act is discovering one's identity, which is very easy to do, as I said in my original posting. Best bet, do not invite strangers to your home.

I want to add something. Hobbyists and providers, alike, overstate the value of mutually assured destruction with personal information. As I said here and on another thread, personal info can be manufactured. I am amused sometimes by those who apparently think LE is unaware of this. Even bogus workplace info. Or those who imagine that internet and text and voice communication are always trustworthy. Even okays without elaboration can and have been misleading. But most importantly, as it relates to a lady's personal safety, do not think for a minute that deranged people think rationally as you might, notwithstanding the info you possess; even temporary derangement arising from jealousy, revenge, or such. And some simply have comparatively little to lose. References by credible sources are paramount.

Edited August 13, 2015 by Servius
Grammar

[Guest]

I have been on the Board since February and this is my first thread. Something happened earlier that has me feeling uneasy. I took a call from a gentleman with an Illinois number and we talked a couple of times and he set up an appointment. I had given him my address to my incall and told him to call me when he was here to get my condo number. He called back ten minutes before said appointment, told me he was here, and asked me for my condo number. Well, I gave it to him and then he just never showed. After calling him back 3 times in a 45 minute period after he was supposedly here, I realized he was a NC/NS. I find it disturbing that this person would tell me he was here when in reality he wasn't and now he knows where I live. My question to other providers is how do you go about this kinda thing instead of the usual "I blocked him on my phone." I would hate to be a sitting duck if he is/was up to no good. To say the least, I am bit raddled.

Sorry this has happened to you. This DB has no integrity and more than likely just lost his nerve and decided to run away, IMHO. Whenever I can't make an appointment that I'd arranged, for any reason, I always let the YL know and ask if I can reschedule for another time that will work for us both. Sometimes the YL will allow a reschedule and sometimes the YL has blacklisted me. Still no excuse for lying about being there if he wasn't. Just my two cents.

[Guest]

do not think for a minute that deranged people think rationally as you might, notwithstanding the info you possess; even temporary derangement arising from jealousy, revenge, or such.

Agreed.

References by credible sources are paramount

I disagree.

I seldom except references. Because we have few "well known providers with fantastic reviews" who have given LE references, and big group of girls got busted. That was not cool. Talk about save your own ass, and oh wait ima bring other girls down too. umm.... no thanks.

There are girls who ask for references, then the provider they got the reference from call her back and complain he just hurt me. The reference was given because he never hurt me.

What about the girls who claim they asked for refences, she never contacted the provider. Then tell the john they did. This is why I do not give a reference unless the guy asks me for it first by filling out my form. Then both get CC on email. No one can lie.

What about the girls who have pimps. Example, a guy will give 2-3 girls as his reference. They all say he legit and safe to see. Then he arrives at your incall, his appointment time. Now you realize the 2-3 girls you just excepted a reference from just gave their PIMP references.

What about the providers who do not give a reference and claim they do, I like to call this behavior "COCK BLOCKING"?

Also, what about the girls who fight over clients? Yes I just said that. Providers have been known to call the clients and tell them off for going and seeing another girl.

These are just a few reasons.

I keep providing information to the legit johns. So you guys can get a p411. Then you guys can see whoever you want without all the drama.

Nothing is ever 100% safe until we have met.

[Guest]

Here is where we disagree. God may have made man and woman, but Samuel Colt made them equal.

True, in my OP women are more evil then men.

[Servius]

Nikki, short answer. This is why I said "credible." Not all sources are credible. I have been around a lot longer than you and have witnessed all you state and more. But there are credible sources. Cock blockers and perfidious people? Of course. Risk free? Of course not. It takes research and time and the willingness to pass up the Franklin for safety. References, credible ones, are still better than any alternative in the absence of personal bedroom interaction. Which is not to say risk free, as I have said repeatedly. I note you recommend p411. That is primarily for reference work. One of several tools a provider ought to employ. I can assure you from empirical evidence, the BP and erstwhile Craigslist women who often enough do not use references (mostly managed, of course) experience much more harm than those who do.

And for the lady who said women are more evil than men, well, I doubt that. I suspect it is distributed rather similarly. Which does not mean our individual experiences are the same, and, of course, said experiences color our outlook and we tend to extraoplate from them. Sometimes erroneously. It is true that in a competitive market environment ... in this case providing consisting mostly of women ... that it might appear that way, but that doesn't mean buyers are any less corrupt or corruptible. The men are not competing in quite the same way (which is not to say there is none, but it is rather different). I suspect a gay male hobby environment would produce a similar amount of scurrilous behavior amongst the providers. In any case, of one thing I am certain: men have been much more destructive, historically.

Edited August 14, 2015 by Servius
Added point on BP etc.

[Guest]

In any case, of one thing I am certain: men have been much more destructive, historically.

It has been my experience that women are better liars, better at setting people up, much more destructive than most men. Less likely to get caught.

Their are providers who are reputable and have fantastic reviews who are ruthless and untrust worthily. I used to think on the same line as you mentioned above, that is until I experienced destructiveness ruthlessness, and much more. I was able to see how many are willing to join in.

I do not forgive and I do not forget. I do not show respect, loyalty, much less trust to these type people.

My list is a very short list of those who can be trusted.

[Servius]

Well, I doubt if we look at the violence in the world that women quite measure up to men in terms of relative danger! As for the hobby, I disagree. As a moderator in a prior life I bounced about equally. I have known many men who lie, and suspect they are just as capable, too. There is research in this but I am too lazy to look it up. . And frankly, when it comes to physical safety I think women are more vulnerable on the basis of a great deal of evidence. As I said in another thread, reviews are fairly meaningless in terms of measuring anything other than a few things, and certainly not integrity. I discourage anyone from judging integrity based on mere text. I am completely unimpressed by popularity or reputation based on reviews, number of posts, etc. i am impressed by deeds, not words ... acts, not mere beliefs or assertions.

[Guest]

Either way I hope this provider remains safe and unharmed.

[Servius]

Absolutely!

And I hope you have no more bad experiences. I think most guys and gals are decent. We are all flawed. But not altogether hopeless. And the few truly corrupt men and women make it bad for everyone. Which is why vigilence is required; trust, but verify, as the Gipper said. Don't let the few make you cynical, though. Some healthy skepticism is always prudent in this endeavor, without regard to one's sex. The only way to avoid the risk associated with the hobby is to leave the hobby. No fun in that, though! One seeks to make the risks tractable; eliminating them is not possible.

[nudiej]

This hobby draws all types for sure. Can you be optimistic and say he got cold feet, sure. Can you say he is trouble and should be blacklisted, sure. And everything in between, sure.

If he got cold feet he should have been in touch and made it up to you.

If he got called away by a SO or a family/employer phone call he should have been in touch and made it up to you.

If he was truly trouble it's great news that he didn't show up.

Sharing his number with other providers in the interest of safety is never a bad idea. Safety is the most important part of this hobby! Without safety, this hobby wouldn't work. And you providers need to share everything possible with each other to stay safe.

Thanks for sharing.

Just an fyi: While I was taking a left on to a provider's street address, I texted her I was a minute away. She texted me back the apartment at the same time I noticed uncle Leo pull in behind me. I pulled into the apartment complex, so did uncle Leo. I parked and he parked next to me. I grabbed my phone and pretended to be talking to someone for a few minutes and he stayed in his car. Just seemed too risky for me. I left. He stayed. I called the provider and rescheduled and she agreed it was weird. I made it up to her in a bigger tip. Just saying there are a million things that happen in any moment.