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False References

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Has any one else noticed the rise in false references given to providers?

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Yes! And a rise in girls refusing to give references.  There's guys out there that think we don't check, so they offer up names. I'm not willing to spend hours checking a guy out. If I can't verify him within an hour through other means than references, I'm not gonna see him.

*******NEW GUYS*****

Please, please, have your references ready! Provide all her info, when you saw her, how you contacted her( phone or email), how she would remember you etc. The more info you give the faster we can book you.

Work smarter, not harder!

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1 minute ago, Melissa Sterling said:

Yes! And a rise in girls refusing to give references.  There's guys out there that think we don't check, so they offer up names. I'm not willing to spend hours checking a guy out. If I can't verify him within an hour through other means than references, I'm not gonna see him.

*******NEW GUYS*****

Please, please, have your references ready! Provide all her info, when you saw her, how you contacted her( phone or email), how she would remember you etc. The more info you give the faster we can book you.

Work smarter, not harder!

AMEN SISTER....

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Maybe not kosher to talk about, but I'm rarely asked for references. Few times I have been asked I've been booked for 'now' with no window to check em. So dudes offering fake ones probably getting away with it more often than not. 

I've always got my references handy. Big fan of the 'ok' system so I ain't gotta track down girls who might be taking a break. But there's an 'on paper' way this  hobby is supposed to work. Rarely matches reality. Good on ya for checking, but you're in a shrinking minority. 

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1 hour ago, Melissa Sterling said:

*******NEW GUYS*****

Please, please, have your references ready! Provide all her info, when you saw her, how you contacted her( phone or email), how she would remember you etc. The more info you give the faster we can book you.

Work smarter, not harder!

Also, make sure that the ladies you use as references are both aware of it and are ok with it. Some women get pretty irritated about being contacted for references (especially when they are either very busy and have little time to respond or when their business is slow and they view the reference as a potential client lost.) A little consideration goes a long way... Besides, you dont want your reference's bad attitude to become part of our first impression of YOU...

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14 minutes ago, Vegas Jen-5884 said:

When their business is slow and they view the reference as a potential client lost.

  This sentence REALLY jumped out. Do any ladies give bad references on purpose, in hopes of the client not scoring the appointment and circling back to them ??

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I can only speak from my own experience/observation here, but there are some very catty and competitive people out there. Some areas seem to be worse than others and since I am fairly new to the Denver scene, I have yet to form an opinion here... That said, I have never heard of a lady giving a bad reference in the way JRwolf mentioned, but I have witnessed providers contacting the hobbiest to either bad-mouth the lady he was considering and/or to try and guilt/persuade him into seeing her instead. 

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Ladies, if you're going to ask me about another member, I am not a viable reference source and will be discrete in my answer, if I know them...always. Gents, a lot have Pm'd, emailed or texted me on certain Ladies. I will always give you my honest opinion there. Everyone BE SAFE please!

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Yes, especially on a different site. Agencies are posting reviews to their girls. So now if I see 1 review sometimes 2 I try to avoid. Has also made me find a handful of women that I truly like and I now stay pretty well in that sphere. (Not complaining mind you as I was burned twice out of 14? Not too bad a ratio and I have found some absolutely wonderful women that I wouldn't trade for the world, you know who you are) 

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1 hour ago, Vegas Jen-5884 said:

Also, make sure that the ladies you use as references are both aware of it and are ok with it. Some women get pretty irritated about being contacted for references (especially when they are either very busy and have little time to respond or when their business is slow and they view the reference as a potential client lost.) A little consideration goes a long way... Besides, you dont want your reference's bad attitude to become part of our first impression of YOU...

First a gazillion rep!!! And yes, some girls get very irritated about refs. The numbers here in Cos, rapidly shrinking!

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1 hour ago, Vegas Jen-5884 said:

I I have never heard of a lady giving a bad reference in the way JRwolf mentioned, but I have witnessed providers contacting the hobbiest to either bad-mouth the lady he was considering and/or to try and guilt/persuade him into seeing her instead. 

 Ahem..its spelled J.R. Wolfe...   That said...any lady that bad mouths another lady to me goes immediately on the "never call again " list. 

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10 minutes ago, JRWolfe said:

 Ahem..its spelled J.R. Wolfe...   That said...any lady that bad mouths another lady to me goes immediately on the "never call again " list. 

Roger that! Um, I mean okie dokie Mr J.R. Wolfe!!! ;-) I wish more folks would play by your set of rules, sir... 

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And I do want to say THANK YOU to the providers that have been polite enough to respond when asking about potential clients....

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I'm always willing to give references. This is a dangerous business we're in and we should be trying to help each other be safe instead of trying to tear each other down. I understand it's a semi competitive field but safety to me always comes first! 

Edited by Cali Rose
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I always provide references... and I expect ladies are reciprocal with them. 

:)

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5 hours ago, Vegas Jen-5884 said:

Also, make sure that the ladies you use as references are both aware of it and are ok with it. Some women get pretty irritated about being contacted for references (especially when they are either very busy and have little time to respond or when their business is slow and they view the reference as a potential client lost.) A little consideration goes a long way... Besides, you dont want your reference's bad attitude to become part of our first impression of YOU...

Clients check with your most recent  provider make sure she is reference friendly. 9 times out of 10 she will not be if you chose not to fallow protcol. 

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Since despite all these current issues references still seem to be preferred so maybe it's time someone takes a different approach. Instead of just a simple OK maybe we should review our clients with a little bit more detail. Just a few sentences on behavior, timeliness, hygiene, quirks etc. If we took five minutes to jot down a note on our clients we save ourselves tons of time on references. Often the hardest part of references is actually getting them, some don't respond, some are just rude and some take forever. But if we write down those details then they're there for everyone to see when then need to see them. Like blacklists but not.

I also like the idea of being able to gush about good clients. I like giving my awesome clients good references. I am happy for other ladies when these great guys choose to see them because I am pretty certain they're going to have a good time. I think a whitelist also encourages ladies to play a little bit more fair and lessen tension. There's no refusing references to ladies you don't like, night owls can get the info they need, short notice appointments are made easier. I know that everyone has their own way of doing things but if reference protocol was a bit more standard it would be much easier.

 

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Isn't this a big reason for using something like P411,    I don't hobby that much locally but having the OK's on P411 has generally done the trick. 

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1 minute ago, VicKosslovich said:

Isn't this a big reason for using something like P411,    I don't hobby that much locally but having the OK's on P411 has generally done the trick. 

P411 isn't a guaranteed "safe" site.... I find the more current 👌's a client has its a little safer.... But the best way is to check references and do a screening .....

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11 minutes ago, Lucy Kitten said:

Since despite all these current issues references still seem to be preferred so maybe it's time someone takes a different approach. Instead of just a simple OK maybe we should review our clients with a little bit more detail. Just a few sentences on behavior, timeliness, hygiene, quirks etc. If we took five minutes to jot down a note on our clients we save ourselves tons of time on references. Often the hardest part of references is actually getting them, some don't respond, some are just rude and some take forever. But if we write down those details then they're there for everyone to see when then need to see them. Like blacklists but not.

I also like the idea of being able to gush about good clients. I like giving my awesome clients good references. I am happy for other ladies when these great guys choose to see them because I am pretty certain they're going to have a good time. I think a whitelist also encourages ladies to play a little bit more fair and lessen tension. There's no refusing references to ladies you don't like, night owls can get the info they need, short notice appointments are made easier. I know that everyone has their own way of doing things but if reference protocol was a bit more standard it would be much easier.

 

I do the very same Lucy! I always rave about my good client.

Protocol is Clients call former provider and ask politely for a reference. As soon as this request is in place.The new provider is free to call. If it has been longer than 4 months and I don't remember the client? I refuse to give a reference other 5than to say,"yes his number is in my phone".

 

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So P411 oks are worthless?  That has not been my experience. On the basis of the quality and number of my oks, most ladies I contact just say "ok."  Or so it seems to me.

Whitelist? In theory I support the idea of "client reviews."   In practice, some problems.  Do clients get to read them? Providers can read their reviews and adjust their behavior accordingly.  They can even rebut them.  Would clients be allowed the same?  If a good client gives a provider a bad review, is it not likely to be reciprocated with a bad client review by that provider even if not deserved? And if clients are not allowed to see their reviews, how can they hope to improve? What is to stop provider A from telling a client that Provider B gave him a bad review...even if not true?

I just don't know the answer to this conundrum.  All I know is that P411 works well for me.  What can be done to make it more reliable for the ladies?

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26 minutes ago, Yorick said:

All I know is that P411 works well for me.

Yes! I will keep using it, as long as it keeps getting me in the door! :D

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1 hour ago, Bella Marie said:

P411 isn't a guaranteed "safe" site.... I find the more current 👌's a client has its a little safer.... But the best way is to check references and do a screening .....

It's my understanding that P411 OKs are to be considered a reference list. A client's prospective ASP is free to contact active providers who have given those OKs for more details. 

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24 minutes ago, Bit Banger said:

It's my understanding that P411 OKs are to be considered a reference list. A client's prospective ASP is free to contact active providers who have given those OKs for more details. 

You're correct, but let me say this. I hate it when a lady asks for "details" for the guy I gave an ok to. I don't write those things down. So, Lucy's idea does have merit. I know P411 has an area for ladies to make notes. For the ladies who are not on P411, this could be handy. It could help save time. 

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31 minutes ago, Bit Banger said:

It's my understanding that P411 OKs are to be considered a reference list. A client's prospective ASP is free to contact active providers who have given those OKs for more details. 

True... But what I meant was... Just because they're on P411 doesn't mean they're safe....I speak from personal experience.... I wish I would have known then what I know now....verification sites are amazing....

Edited by Bella Marie
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I'm always reference friendly up to 6 months.  Text gets fastest response.  No need for a gentleman to contact me first.

Giving references should be common practice because it helps keep all of us safe.

Hope everyone has a fantastic day!!😘

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11 hours ago, Yorick said:

So P411 oks are worthless?  That has not been my experience. On the basis of the quality and number of my oks, most ladies I contact just say "ok."  Or so it seems to me.

Whitelist? In theory I support the idea of "client reviews."   In practice, some problems.  Do clients get to read them? Providers can read their reviews and adjust their behavior accordingly.  They can even rebut them.  Would clients be allowed the same?  If a good client gives a provider a bad review, is it not likely to be reciprocated with a bad client review by that provider even if not deserved? And if clients are not allowed to see their reviews, how can they hope to improve? What is to stop provider A from telling a client that Provider B gave him a bad review...even if not true?

I just don't know the answer to this conundrum.  All I know is that P411 works well for me.  What can be done to make it more reliable for the ladies?

The great thing about a whitelist as is the same with blacklists is that they are not for client eyes. You don't know what we say in references so why would it be different if it's typed out? This is why ladies need their own space because it's easy to misunderstand. A whitelist would be for good clients but you automatically go to what if someone says something bad about me!?! We already have blacklists, we don't need that. What we need is a spot where we can put the standard info like was he late? Was he nice? Did he require a shower?  Just the things we need to know in print so we can bypass the real time difficulties of getting references and avoid those that don't want to give them.

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12 hours ago, Yorick said:

So P411 oks are worthless?  That has not been my experience. On the basis of the quality and number of my oks, most ladies I contact just say "ok."  Or so it seems to me.

Whitelist? In theory I support the idea of "client reviews."   In practice, some problems.  Do clients get to read them? Providers can read their reviews and adjust their behavior accordingly.  They can even rebut them.  Would clients be allowed the same?  If a good client gives a provider a bad review, is it not likely to be reciprocated with a bad client review by that provider even if not deserved? And if clients are not allowed to see their reviews, how can they hope to improve? What is to stop provider A from telling a client that Provider B gave him a bad review...even if not true?

I just don't know the answer to this conundrum.  All I know is that P411 works well for me.  What can be done to make it more reliable for the ladies?

They are worthless if you haven't had an ok in over 6 months because guys tend to think that because they have over 40 oks they are fine when in reality we have had cases where guys have that many, and they turn around and get violent(among other things). If you want to use P411 and use it as a reference tool, you need to keep it current by not being lazy and thinnking that your past is going to get you through the door.

I understand that some of you find an ATF, and that is ok...have her give out a reference if you are feeling a certain "itch" she can't scratch, but if you found one on P411 and still seeing her, ask her to update the ok...they tend to be more than happy to do that.

xoxo,

Samantha Sheppard

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12 minutes ago, Lucy Kitten said:

The great thing about a whitelist as is the same with blacklists is that they are not for client eyes. You don't know what we say in references so why would it be different if it's typed out? This is why ladies need their own space because it's easy to misunderstand. A whitelist would be for good clients but you automatically go to what if someone says something bad about me!?! We already have blacklists, we don't need that. What we need is a spot where we can put the standard info like was he late? Was he nice? Did he require a shower?  Just the things we need to know in print so we can bypass the real time difficulties of getting references and avoid those that don't want to give them.

I would love this because what I like is not the same for what you like, and so on. It would give us insight on if the client is a "fit". One of my problems with vague references is that I never know if he thinks he is going to get the same thing that he got from the previous girl, and that has happened where they bring up that "this girl does this" and then I have to give my speal as to why he should have done his homework and read my reviews, website, etc. to know what to expect. I also think it would be nice to know what to expect so I can plan accordingly to how they are.

Something I find funny is the ladies that get jealous about references...don't they realize that most of these guys see more than one girl and they definitely will when they know you are ok with other ladies, or have lady friends? They are not married to these guys or dating them so where do you they feel they have a right or a claim to them. Boggles my mind!

xoxo,

Samantha Sheppard

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1 hour ago, SultryKitten said:

Something I find funny is the ladies that get jealous about references...don't they realize that most of these guys see more than one girl and they definitely will when they know you are ok with other ladies, or have lady friends? They are not married to these guys or dating them so where do you they feel they have a right or a claim to them. Boggles my mind!

xoxo,.

Samantha Sheppard

bitch_pudding_by_lpixiefairyl-d4h11el.jp

BAMB Bitches !! :P

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