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Bigbiz

Getting started into this hobby.

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Hi everyone Bigabiz here reporting for another new bee question that you guys can beat me up for asking. I was much more involved in this community 4 years ago before I fell in love and thought I would never come back to this site again. But that did not work out so back to being a connoisseur. Anyways the point of this post was when I first joined it was easy for a newbie with no references or p411 account to get appointments with providers. Now it is like Fort Knox in here. I do not have a traditional job where people can call and verify my employment which means I do not think p411 would approve me either since there process is the same. So is there any other way for me to get back in the in crowd? I am a gentlemen that would not mind doing extra or taking one of you ladies out for lunch or dinner.. Any suggestions?

Edited by Kaduk
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43 minutes ago, Bigbiz said:

Hi everyone Bigabiz here reporting for another new bee question that you guys can beat me up for asking. I was much more involved in this community 4 years ago before I fell in love and thought I would never come back to this site again. But that did not work out so back to being a connoisseur. Anyways the point of this post was when I first joined it was easy for a newbie with no references or p411 account to get appointments with providers. Now it is like Fort Knox in here. I do not have a traditional job where people can call and verify my employment which means I do not think p411 would approve me either since there process is the same. So is there any other way for me to get back in the in crowd? I am a *** friendly gentlemen that would not mind doing extra or taking one of you ladies out for lunch or dinner.. Any suggestions?

This is what I was getting at in the hotel protocol thread, but it is probably worth its own discussion. I understand that a get acquainted meeting with compensation is not a substitute for screening. I find myself in much the same situation as Bigbiz. I haven't met anyone new in years. Dropped p411 cuz i wasn't using it and my OK's would by now be beyond stale. The only person who can verify my employment is me. 

In prehistoric times, before we were all electronically up each others ass 24/7, it was not uncommon to meet a prospective playmate for coffee or a drink to see how things went before moving on to more intimate activity.

I know the standard answer to posts like this is to find the girls that are newbie friendly and on p411, give them what they require, then use them to get p411 up and running and current. And maybe that's what I will end up doing. But if I pay your rate and take you to lunch and chew with my mouth closed and don't put my elbows on the table, maybe we could work something out, right? 

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Having been in the hobby for a while, I have noticed the change.  Everyone is becoming more cautious.  I believe that there are a number of the older, more experienced providers here who trust their gut above all other means of screening.  They may be happy to meet over drinks or dinner first.  If you can get in their good graces, a reference to P411 would follow. 

For the first time in many years, when my P411 subscription was up for renewal, I thought about it quite a while before renewing. I have not seen a new (to me) provider for many months.  The last one I saw, a lady who posts here, provided well above average service, but I did not ask her for an ok, nor did I review her.  I might even go back to see her some time (I would hope I was clean and polite enough that she would see me again), but that is the problem:  I already have many ladies I have seen once or twice who also showed me a very good time.  And, I have settled on a couple of favorites that, in addition to providing good service, I just really like.

How much more wonderfulness does a guy need?  Despite the temptations of the many beautiful women here, I just don't envision seeing that many "new" ladies this year......unless my favs retire. (Please!  No!)  If you get a whiff of a hint that your "steady" is thinking of retirement, ask her for introductions to other ladies before she disappears.  That way, you won't be left stranded.

 

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I am coming from ECCIE and I do know that it's not big in the scene. But the best way coming from a lady who doesn't see newbies  is to go see a couple ladies that are newbie friendly. Make sure before you contact them that you ask if they are reference friendly.  Most ladies like myself who are heavy screeners  will take two references from well known providers. There are many newbie friendly gals out there.  Just make sure it's a local gal and that she is on TOB or ECCIE, so that way the gals you do want to see can verify you.  I personally love P411 and it's always been always go to, but I have taken provider references when they don't use the social media of the mongers.   I hope this helps. :-) 

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3 hours ago, Raoul said:

I know the standard answer to posts like this is to find the girls that are newbie friendly and on p411, give them what they require, then use them to get p411 up and running and current. And maybe that's what I will end up doing. But if I pay your rate and take you to lunch and chew with my mouth closed and don't put my elbows on the table, maybe we could work something out, right? 

Obviously, it's up to each woman to decide what she will do.

If I were a provider, lunch wouldn't work for me. It doesn't prove you're trustworthy, not LE, non-violent, or even a nice guy. Anyone can get fake IDs (especially LE employees, and career criminals), speak nicely for an hour, lie, and pretend to be someone they aren't.

The newbie friendly girls take a HUGE risk, IMO, and I would never do it, if I were female.

Just my 2 cents. :)

 

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Yeah lunches do nothing for me. Only tells me so much.  I used to be one of those newbie  friendly girls many moons ago, I don't know what I was thinking. Well yes I do $$$ I started with an escort agency  who kept me safe, then when I went independent in the Craigslist days I was so stupid and lost.  It only took getting off of backpage and  Craigslist to figure it out. But I don't care how much someone shows me identity  wise. Unless  two reputable ladies have seen him and I can verify it, or he's a massive reviewer on a big board. I am just not willing to risk it any longer.  

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4 hours ago, Bigbiz said:

Hi everyone Bigabiz here reporting for another new bee question that you guys can beat me up for asking. I was much more involved in this community 4 years ago before I fell in love and thought I would never come back to this site again. But that did not work out so back to being a connoisseur. Anyways the point of this post was when I first joined it was easy for a newbie with no references or p411 account to get appointments with providers. Now it is like Fort Knox in here. I do not have a traditional job where people can call and verify my employment which means I do not think p411 would approve me either since there process is the same. So is there any other way for me to get back in the in crowd? I am a 420 friendly gentlemen that would not mind doing extra or taking one of you ladies out for lunch or dinner.. Any suggestions?

Could you use any references from when you were active (four years ago)? No one's going to beat up an old member who's coming back from hiatus. 

Welcome back!

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13 minutes ago, pfunk said:

If I were a provider, lunch wouldn't work for me. It doesn't prove you're trustworthy, not LE, non-violent, or even a nice guy. Anyone can get fake IDs (especially LE employees, and career criminals), speak nicely for an hour, lie, and pretend to be someone they aren't.

If I can't pretend to be someone I'm not, I don't wanna play. :cool:

I get what you're saying and Spice makes her completely reasonable position very clear. I do think a get acquainted meeting , on the clock, ought to alleviate the LE fear. I've never heard of them going to that much effort to net a single arrest; but I guess just cuz I've never heard of it doesn't mean it hasn't happened.

As for the rest of it; "newbie friendly" might just be the new unicorn. 

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I could help you find several newbie friendly ladies in the 200 hour range. And LE have gone as far as going on full blown dates with ladies and had some touching and groping before the arrest happened.   As for using old references. I don't see the issue as long as they are still hobbying, still remember  you and still have a good record themselves.  I have accepted very odd references 

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29 minutes ago, MisterBigShot said:

No one's going to beat up an old member who's coming back from hiatus. 

Well they might but would probably charge extra for that.:cool:

All of my OK's are over 4 years old and not one is from a current provider. As for asking either of the two ladies I occasionally see to be a reference or give me new OK's if I renew p411 so I can see new girls... that could very well lead to additions to Nikki's BSC list. :cool:

Probably best to just go along with the status quo. Sure hope I die before they retire.

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3 hours ago, SpiceInCo said:

 or he's a massive reviewer on a big board. I am just not willing to risk it any longer.  

I am a massive guy with 5 reviews... Does that count?  ;-)

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I once had a "coffee date" screening. She was quite content that I was legit. I, on the other hand, was not interested in seeing her after a questionable comment. It seems very unlikely that LE would take the time to get coffee, or buy you a meal just to bust an escort. Possible? Sure. Anything is possible. But very, very unlikely. If you want no risk, you're in the wrong line of work. I'd say not accepting "coffee date" screening is boardering on paranoia. Just my opinion. 

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10 minutes ago, easyfriend33 said:

.. . It seems very unlikely that LE would take the time to get coffee, or buy you a meal just to bust an escort. Possible? Sure. Anything is possible. But very, very unlikely. ...

Especially if the coffee location is of the YL's choosing. Not enough control for an LE sting. 

I would still avoid sex/$s conversations. 

Edited by Bit Banger
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12 minutes ago, Bit Banger said:

Especially if the coffee location is of the YL's choosing. Not enough control for an LE sting. 

I would still avoid sex/$s conversations. 

Good point. I was assuming that. Yes, any red flag conversations would be a coffee date fail for either party. Actually, that is exactly what happend on my end. She implied that she did some unsafe things with clients so my interest was over immedately. I was happy to pay for a cup of coffee and a quick visit rate to avoid her. 

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I understand that everyone wants to be safe and take as much room for error out of the equation. But your telling me a cop or a bad person cannot get a friend or a store owner to answer a phone and say yeah so and so works here? Or they can sign up for a p411 account? P411 will take anyone's money. I have a place I can use for a work reference but I would be embarrassed as hell if someone at this family business found out what I like to do on my free time.

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Atleast during coffee or a lunch date you can get a vibe. If the person is crazy, they are not going to be able to contain it that well. Or if they have an aggressive demeanor you will notice. You can see how clean they are and how they carry themselves, what they are driving. Unless they are a complete sociopath which are far and few between. Give me 30 minutes with someone and I should have a good idea if there atleast good or bad.

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39 minutes ago, Bigbiz said:

I understand that everyone wants to be safe and take as much room for error out of the equation. But your telling me a cop or a bad person cannot get a friend or a store owner to answer a phone and say yeah so and so works here? Or they can sign up for a p411 account? P411 will take anyone's money. I have a place I can use for a work reference but I would be embarrassed as hell if someone at this family business found out what I like to do on my free time.

Would be less effort than meeting someone for coffee or lunch. 

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It's funny how many of us are in the same boat.  I have been away for a few years too and my ATFs had retired so basically starting over again.  Luckily I was able to recover my TOB account so at least I don't look like a complete newbie.  Still debating if I want to go back to p411 since I usually stay with the same ladies after I find the ones that I like.  Unfortunately in your situation I think newbie friendly ladies are your best option.  Good luck.

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1 hour ago, kawirider5 said:

 Unfortunately in your situation I think newbie friendly ladies are your best option.  Good luck.

Newbie friendly = text a pic of your ID. At least that's what I have found in my comprehensive research thus far (2 attempts). :huh:

It really doesn't matter that we guys without current references or OK's think a paid pre-screen meeting makes sense. The one lady who weighed in said no thanks. Pfunk (who used to have the keys to the ladies locker room:cool:) says it wouldn't do any good. 

Seems everybody's spidey senses are on high alert these days. Not really a surprise; we swim in treacherous waters :unsure:

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11 hours ago, easyfriend33 said:

 

Good point. I was assuming that. Yes, any red flag conversations would be a coffee date fail for either party. Actually, that is exactly what happend on my end. She implied that she did some unsafe things with clients so my interest was over immedately. I was happy to pay for a cup of coffee and a quick visit rate to avoid her. 

I agree, totally tanks risks for both parties if you avoid the wrong conversations.  Basically, you are entering the realm of a proper date so I could not  fathom how LE can go after you.  After all you were technically dating.   Unless, you are suspected Russian spy or something... 

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Newbie friendly does not mean text a picture of your id. Newbie friendly providers know how to screen

 It's not that difficult.  And no, a lunch meeting means nothing.

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Abigailfox since a lunch would do nothing for you.. What else could I do? I am open for any and all suggestions.. Has anyone took the time to search newbie friendly on the ad boards? It is slim pickings on there. I know in my situation, I have to build a resume to get where I would like to be. But ouch is it rough on that board for a newbie.

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41 minutes ago, abigailfox said:

Newbie friendly does not mean text a picture of your id. Newbie friendly providers know how to screen

Like I said, it wasn't a big sample size. As for the secret screening sauce of the newbie friendly provider, I know better than to ask. That formula is guarded more closely than Coke.:cool:

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I don't know. The first local provider I saw was happy to have my real phone number. It was enough for her to figure out I wasn't  LE. That's more information than I typically give now, but it's a far cry from confirming my employment. I made mistakes, too. I did once send a picture of my license. I wouldn't do it again. You just don't need to reveal that much. 

Spend some time here. Talk to the ladies who post here. Get to know them a little bit and I bet you can get an appointment. Then write a review. You'll be a known quantity in no time. Mainly, just don't worry about it too much. Contact some ladies and try to set something up. If they won't see you now, be polite and explain that you completely understand and check back with them after you get established. Move on to the next one who caught your eye. 

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Mr. Bigbiz. Good grief.  You say "p411 will take anyone's money"  Have you called them and explained your situation?  They are usually pretty helpful - careful yes but their business is acquiring new clients/providers not rejecting them.  Then you spend time describing how you could game the system, but expect providers to accept at face value that you are trust worthy.  Hmmmm. Lastly, you say you were active in the community four years ago.  Active how?  Any of the ladies you saw then still active? Call one if so.  If you were so "active" what was your handle? P411 used to give some credence to established board presence/reputation.  Less whining about why p411 is easy to game but you can;t get in, how this board is like "fort knox" and bitching that ladies should be cool with a lunch screening, etc. (news flash they pick the screening method, you don't) and more research/calling would serve you well.  Or are you just hoping an established member will tell you "hey, give Betsy Bangs Well a call" so you can call her and say "Hey Betsy, John Long Dong recommended you and said to call and mention his name" ???

Oh, and welcome to the board. Hope you enjoy. I think you have a lot more options than you make it sound like.  ;)

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5 hours ago, Bigbiz said:

 Has anyone took the time to search newbie friendly on the ad boards?

Funny you should ask. On this ad board, going back to Nov of 2015, there are 17 ladies represented. (out of 554 ads in that period). 

I see a few in that 17 I'd like to meet. So...there's hope :cool:

Edited by Raoul
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7 hours ago, Bigbiz said:

. Has anyone took the time to search newbie friendly on the ad boards? 

Ok, since I had a little spare time.   A search on P411 in Denver alone reveals 65 that claim to be "newbie friendly - no references required".  Obviously it is assumed that the appointment request is from a p411 client.  So again - have you called them to investigate options?  Sorry, just not seeing the "slim pickings" argument.

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The first lady I ever saw was recommended by someone on this board who had become a friend. The lady was verified by this friend as not crazy, but she needed to know who I was. I gave her the web site of my business, and she said, "we're all set" and gave me the address. For me, it was stunning how easy it was. Did I give personal info? Yes. Could I have been utterly driven insane by a bat shit crazy provider? Yes.  As we have gone over ad nauseum, a small percentage of ladies want to ruin your life (between 1% to 7% by some accounts).  I saw one woman through PMs right here on the board. She had seen my messages/posts for a long time and trusted me, and then acquaintance of hers also trusted me. I never joined P411, but I'm also overwhelmingly an FBSM guy. Incidentally, FBSM generally requires far less screening, at least that is my experience, so you may wish to start with that if you really need to get your ya yas out. 

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7 hours ago, pitbull said:

... Incidentally, FBSM generally requires far less screening, at least that is my experience, so you may wish to start with that if you really need to get your ya yas out. 

I don't understand this because the only legal Happy Ending is self-service; even that's a grey area. CO code make no distinction between HJ, BJ, or FS. They all involve touching genitals for sexual gratification. 

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Gro8owl you are too wound up my friend, this is a forum chat try to learn how to talk to people the right way. you come off angry like your ready to attack someone, this is just conversation. If you type newbie friendly in the search engine like I did you will see only 4-5 different girls pop up. I plan on avoiding p411 all together and will slowly build my resume as time goes on. This is all personal preference, I will hobby in a way that I am comfortable just like everyone else would like to. I have no clue what my old handle is or was and tried to use the email I have now to retrieve it but had no success. As far as providers go I have atleast two girls I could never forget but it's been years, I doubt they remember who I am. So I am supposed to be like hey I am so and so can I see you again or use you as a reference ? She not gonna remember me because it's been years and she's seen hundreds of guys if not more in the last 4 yrs. How is that a realistic option? It's not like we dated or spent hours on the phone or went to dinners and clubs.. There's a reason the term "John" exists. We are a dime a dozen. My hope is to shed some light on the situation and talk with people that may or may not be in my boat. If you read the comments , you can see I am by far not the only guy. If I am smart enough to make the spare money to afford this hobby, I am sure I can get some appointments set up. 

Edited by Bigbiz
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